Risk of catching HIV?

[frogpatrol]

Get tested. The tests here, if done at a reputable establishment, are the same as in Europe.

 

The Thai Red Cross just next to the water tower off Sarasin Road/Lumpini Park has anonymous HIV tests for about 200 Baht (more or less). Results in 20 minutes.

 

Good luck.

[junglesoup]

josh_ingu said:

 

>He drinks in the tequila bar on soi 4, which is in the carpark after the 7/eleven.

 

Ah! The Tequila bar on soi 4. Yes, the well known hang out of eminent virologists, retrovirologists and immunologists. Many a night has been spent there quaffing beers and discussing the ability of the HIV gp120 envelope glycoprotein to initiate a signaling cascade that involves the p38 mitogen-activated protein kinase.

 

oops. Sorry, forgot. Sarcasm is not your strong point. Anyway, the point I am trying to make here is that you met a guy in a bar ( a "top" medical expert *and* a vietnam vet *and* - if you asked him - who probably does a bit of covert work for the CIA on the side) who told you one of the biggest crock of shits going and you took it on board. Ask yourself whether it is likely that a consultant to Bumigrad is likely to "hang out" in a bar and moreover think of investing in a dodgy bar in bangkok?

 

>But if he really has the reputation that he is suppose to have then he is a top Dr.

 

And when I am not doing the boring stuff I spend my day doing, I am really an astronaut. Honest.

-j-

 

I never actually mentioned that I believed it. I was just stating what I heard. As I said if you feel that strongly about it challenge him yourself. Don' t know how often he is there, as he hardly drinks. All I m saying is that I ve heard it from a few sources before that he is a top doctor in his field. I can't remember his second name as its been a while since I spoke to him, and only once. But I do remember I did a search online the next day and he had stuff published on some medical websites.

 

When he did come into the bar, he only drank 1 or 2 bottles of beer and left just after 10. I ve spoke to him once and been in there twicw when he was in.

As I say. Challenge him for youself, rather than argue it with someone online who only quoted him. Of course if hes being irresponsible then its anyones prerogative to challenge him.

 

My point is that just because he drinks sometimes in a bar on soi 4 doesnt mean he isn't a doctor. Maybe you know alot more about HIV than me. I don't know too much about it, so I 'm not not in a place to argue The thing is I didnt run out and bareback bargirls after that. So to say I took on board is wide of the mark.

 

Cheers,

Chris

[lembeh]

 

 

>So to say I took on board is wide of the mark.

 

Fair enough.

 

Unfortunately there is a load of nonsense and mis-information out there, and even posting things like "its impossible to get because"....adds to the general miasma of dross. Whatever insane stuff gets put around *someone* will believe it.

 

-j-

[buddha]

Josh_ingu - that was some of the funniest back and forth I have read in a while, thank you.....

[junglesoup]

josh_ingu said:

 

 

>So to say I took on board is wide of the mark.

 

Fair enough.

 

Unfortunately there is a load of nonsense and mis-information out there, and even posting things like "its impossible to get because"....adds to the general miasma of dross. Whatever insane stuff gets put around *someone* will believe it.

 

-j-

 

Hope theres no hard feelings Josh? I don t want people to think I go around bare backing lots of Thai girls. I thought after that its probably not a good idea to post stuff like that. I wish it was true what he said, and you know there probably will be someone who takes on board what he said.

 

BTW Josh is there any grey area in the medical world about heterosexual infection through vaginal intercourse?

I know there was before when it was considered the "gay plague"

I'm not prepared to take the risk whatever way right now.

Take care,

Chris.

[lembeh]

 

>Hope theres no hard feelings Josh?

 

None at all.

 

The main problem is that the subject is *complicated*, and frankly the large majority of people get bored with complicated stories and prefer a "quick-fix" answer. The fact that it was some one passing himself off as an "expert" on this issue and spouting dangerous nonesense got my goat a bit.

 

Anyway, to avoid an answer that takes 5 days for me to write...lets see....hmmm.

 

OK. The *best* studies that address the issue are those based on what are called "discordant couples". This is where a couple in a long term relationship (married maybe) and one of the couple is diagnosed as HIV+, while the other is not. Many of these couples (and there are straight and gay couples studied but we will focus on straight) are followed for *years*. They record sexual activity (type etc) as well as things like compliance with condom usage (always, sometimes, never, accidents) etc, and from this, people try to work out what is the "risk" of transmission. Bluntly, [color:red]in the absence of other factors[/color] it looks as though female to male transmission is relatively "low risk" (I would have to look up the exact figure, but think its 1: several hundred, but thats an off the cuff memory, so don't quote me). Male to female risk is MUCH higher. Of course, thats also trying to sort out the different sexual activities - for example how many times is sex pure straight vaginal penatrative sex(for example no bj starter)? Difficult to sort out right? Now thats basically your "odds" of getting HIV in bonking a HIV plus person, and any one who gambles knows that odds only come out over large groups over a long period of time. Some one might go 10,000 times with no problems. Some one else might get unlucky first time. So in terms of an individual, on a particular occassion odds really are not that much of a guarantee.

 

Now, the CRUX of the matter is the bit in red. In the absence of other factors. Throw in any number of factors into that equation and the "odds" go straight out the window. Main factor? A pre-existing STD. For example if *you* have an STD (and do not forget that a LOT of STD's are "silent" with no symptoms) your "odds" of getting it go up through the roof (start thinking bloody likely). If *she* has another STD (and HIV is often found to co-exist with other STD's) your odds of getting it go through the roof.

 

Obviously here we are really only looking at the chance of you getting HIV from an infected woman, but the reverse is also true for a woman getting it from a man.

 

Other factors are skin abrasions (cuts tears or nicks) in the skin of the penis (or inside the woman) -again, you get up to much, much more likely to get. One more facor that is recently comming to light is "thinning" of the skin, so you do not need to have a cut or abrasion, just thinner skin. Steriods for example can thin the skin as well as a lot of other things. So you do not even need a cut or tear, just a temporary thining of the skin of the penis to put your chance of getting it up through the roof.

 

Other factors can include the *type* of the HIV virus, different strains appear to have a greater propensity to spread (are moe virluent). Or how about whether you are circumcised or not? That can make a big difference (circumcised men seem to have a protection factor against contracting, it looks like the foreskin is a fertile infection zone).

 

Or how about your particular genetic make up? Seems some people *might* be immune from catching HIV. These studies are based one people who have been exposed many, many, many times to HIV but never got it (some hookers in africa, some very active gay men etc).

 

OK, so without going on further, I think (if you have read this far!) that you can see its really not an easy question to answer about how easy (or not) is it to get.

 

OK, maybe two last points. Firstly I do *not* consider myself an "expert" on HIV, perhaps well informed, but compared to the *real* experts who work in the field, no. In fact only yesterday I listened to a research talk on HIV and learnt some new things.

 

Lastly, never trust medical advice from a guy you met in the pub (or perhaps even posted on a message board!!). There are LOTS of excellent sources out there on HIV/AIDS etc all of which are easily accessible on the web and are much more coherently written than I can manage. Maybe spend some time surfing around and see what you can find.

cheers

josh

[Encore]

Thank you Josh, for excellent information.

[Sayboo]

Now, the CRUX of the matter is the bit in red. In the absence of other factors. Throw in any number of factors into that equation and the "odds" go straight out the window. Main factor? A pre-existing STD. For example if *you* have an STD (and do not forget that a LOT of STD's are "silent" with no symptoms) your "odds" of getting it go up through the roof (start thinking bloody likely).

 

This is what has me the most nervous. I think STD's were both present. Ouch.

 

 

 

[junglesoup]

Cheers Josh,

Thats pretty informative. I was on the WHO website yesterday and read some stuff on there. Theres lots of studies on there. Thanks again JOsh

,Chris.

[lembeh]

 

>I was on the WHO website yesterday

 

An excellent place to start.

cheers

josh